The Profitable Chiro Network w/ Dr. Daniel Kimbley
Welcome to The Profitable Chiro Network with Dr. Daniel Kimbley…
On this podcast, we take deep dives into the science of success, stress, and sustainable practice growth—through the lens of God’s intelligent design. From unlocking the power of your prefrontal cortex to breaking free from pain patterns and maximizing clinic profitability, these conversations challenge conventional wisdom and reshape the way you think about chiropractic, business, and life. This is The Profitable Chiro Network.
The Profitable Chiro Network w/ Dr. Daniel Kimbley
Ep 8: Beyond the Grind: How Embracing Flow State Transforms Business and Life
Watch the full length video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZ8orvDHjj0
Welcome back to another episode of the Profitable Chiro Network. I am the host, dr Daniel, and my beautiful wife, heather, is here with me today. Welcome. And if you think that grinding harder is the answer to all your problems, I don't want to call you dumb, but I just want to say it's not the most wise decision. And what we're going to talk about today is how the prefrontal cortex works. We're going to talk about flow state, which I think is super important, and, uh, some of the neurology that's involved along the way. And so I think that, like, what I hear often is the solution or the suggestion that, like, you just got to grind harder and then one day, someday, you can get to the point where you can take vacation one day, someday. One day, someday, um, and I'm going to like, actually, let me just go dark. I was, I had no intention of doing this, but I'm going to, so we'll just start real dark right off the bat.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:My dad passed away last year. Yes, dad worked his whole life Very, very hard, saved a lot of money, hoping one day someday he could retire. Did he get the chance to do it? He did not, so I would just in, I will go on record to say that the one day, someday, mentality may not be the best way, and I want to talk about my. I want to talk about mindset. I want to talk about the marathon approach, which is something that I just kind of thought of from a conversation I was having with a friend. And let's jump into it, let's do it. Yeah, um, I would love for you to start it out actually. So, um, if we go back, a couple of nights ago, we were sitting on the couch having a conversation. I think I was doing something super productive and intelligent, and you were on social media.
Heather Kimbley:I'm just kidding. I think we were actually both on social media.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Um, I was just trying to make a funny joke but I just felt too guilty about it. Yeah, so you were on social, I was on social, and if you could just share, like what you saw, don't share names or any of that stuff, but just give me the premise of what you saw.
Heather Kimbley:Sure, I just saw a post from a friend acquaintance that's an entrepreneur, um runs his own business, and it was talking about it was being very vulnerable about how, like he was just grinding it out and working and hustling so hard for the first several years in his business and then now, you know, like 10 years into it, he's able to, like, enjoy the time with his family and go on vacations and all these things. And he was talking about a strategy that was like here is the best strategy that has worked for me. It's grind as hard as I can, hustle as hard as I can until spring break and then I can enjoy my spring vacation, and then I grind as hard as I can and hustle as hard as I can until Memorial Day weekend and then I can enjoy the three-day weekend and then grind and hustle until July 4th and then I can enjoy that weekend and so forth and so forth. So it's like you put in all this energy and working as hard as you can, hustling, neglecting family, neglecting friends, maybe some other priorities, if you will just to enjoy this short period of time and then to get right back into the same grind, grind, grind, grind, grind and then hope that I can enjoy and decompress and not burn out and actually reduce that stress over like the next three days over Memorial weekend.
Heather Kimbley:And I just felt like it was it's completely opposite of how we live our lives First off, complete opposite, like we work hard and we enjoy our family time and we play together as a family and we get so much of that time together. So in my brain and I also think, like as a female, it was kind of like whoa, I could never have a family like that. It's just not a value for me. It would be challenging because I'm a quality time person first off and I wouldn't want to experience something like that with somebody and for my family.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Have we ever had times in our lives when you felt like we were doing the opposite, because I feel like we have a pretty good balance now and that's the point, like, if we want to call it something else, we call this episode balance, but neither here nor there have you seen times in our lives when we felt like we were out of balance, where we were just grinding, or I was just grinding and not there.
Heather Kimbley:Sure and not there, sure. I mean, I think that's also a part of life and you have these seasons where there can be and will be short periods of times, especially as a business owner. I think that, like there are times when we're called to put in more time and not necessarily put your family on the back burner, cause that's not what I'm saying at all, but it's more like there have been times where you've had to put in a little bit of extra time on the weekends for certain tasks, to move forward in certain areas of business. And I also understand that it's temporary, and by temporary it's always extremely short. Temporary for us, like as a family, because you see the priority and value in creating time for us as a family.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, I, I, I think about, like the Bahamas. I think we went too long. We went to the Bahamas in December and I think I went too long grinding without a break and it took me the whole entire vacation to feel normal again.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah, that was for you, though, like Coco and I never felt that. I think as a family as a whole, we were all grinding and working hard, coco included. She had so many responsibilities with ballet that season.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, I forgot about all that.
Heather Kimbley:We were all pretty exhausted with our responsibilities, but I don't think any of us felt like there was no balance, like we all created that time and very intentional time.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, yeah. Why does all this matter?
Heather Kimbley:Just creating, like, a balance in life within anybody that, like owns a business or has a family. I think that you want to be able to create this flow, if you will, within your family dynamic, to be present and create memories that are there for all the parties involved parties involved.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, it comes down to. I think it's easy to make money and use that as a sense of security, but if it comes at the expense of not enjoying it like I heard somebody say this one time a mentor of mine, and I think it's one of the most powerful things that I've ever heard rings true in my head every single day you can't buy back the memories that you never had. Wow, keyword in that you can't buy back, so you can have all the money in the world, all the money in the world. I'm not saying money's not important. That's not what I'm saying. Uh, it makes some things easier. It makes some things more complex. This isn't necessarily a money conversation, but it's a flow conversation and like getting into the flow of life so that you don't burn out. We talked about burnout a couple episodes ago, right, and then not only just how you don't burn out, but also how to like have fun through every phase of life, and when we talk about profit, that's really what we're talking about.
Heather Kimbley:Profiting from experiences together with your family, friends.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:whatever you prioritize, people who don't give themselves enough credit on the how smart they are and intelligent are business front and they're teaching people to just work harder. And in some ways, I would tell a lot of people like I think you've been lied to, because a lot of times grinding harder isn't going to get you what you want. And an example for me from my life is when, if you remember, when I was writing that book and I was going hard, like every day, I was up at three 30, I was straight on the bike and I was pedaling and I was typing and I just got to the point where I was burned out and I lost my creativity. I forgot why I was doing it. A whole bunch of ego came into the picture. There were all these things happening that could have just been like oh, you just need to take a break, or whatever.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:But when you really think about what was happening under the surface, it's just that my brain was changing based on how I was burning it down, and so you know that's the problem, I think, is that we've been programmed to work harder, and so you know that's the problem, I think, is that we've been programmed to work harder, that we've been programmed to grind harder, but without remembering that it's a really simple. If we zoom way out, it's a really simple principle that we're taught as we were kids, and it's the principle of the tortoise and the hare. It's not complex, right, it's not complex, and what I think is really interesting about it is, I think, about the concept of the tortoise and the hare. It gets into this concept of what I would consider patience.
Heather Kimbley:Which we could all benefit of more of.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, we all could. And then I get into. So for me, the way my brain works is I start thinking about well, where's patients come from? Well, it comes from the prefrontal cortex. But if we burn out the prefrontal cortex because we're grinding so hard and we deplete our neurotransmitters, then we have more difficulty not just expressing patients, which is a fruit of the spirit, but is joy and peace and love.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And you know there are others, um, those faithfulness is one, there are nine total, Is that right? But I think I think the biggest one, I think the biggest one for that. Well, one of them is self-control as well. But just remembering that the fruits of the spirit are expressed when we are in a flow state, which is super cool, yeah, and the flow state are all of the things that we would want Kindness, patience, love, fulfillment, self-control, etc. Etc. We would want those when we are with our family, For sure.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:But if we grind and grind and grind, I would argue that we start to lose the gifts of the spirit. You're depleting those, yeah, very intentionally, but there's also so there's a silver lining in this too is that you can do certain things to your brain to create a flow state that will actually allow you to express more of it. So this means more productivity, this means a sense, more of a sense of purpose, more fun, more joy, more fulfillment, and I think that's what you're really talking about when you're talking about our experience as a family. Is this idea that, like, we can do fun things and we can play on Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and then we come into the office and we work, but we're not grinding for months at a time without taking any break For sure.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, so what is um, what is like? Can you think of a time when you felt that tough drag, burnout, exhaustion? I'm grinding really hard.
Heather Kimbley:I mean, I know that, I've experienced that, I just can't think of a specific time. Heather's perfect. No, no, no.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Here's what's interesting. So if we back up and we go, big picture remember I talked about tortoise in the hair, this idea of patience, right? I think that there is a specific God design to exactly how our brain works and operates to get us into a flow state. Okay, okay, and being in the flow state is arguably more important than hustling and grinding. Tell me more.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And there's been research since the 70s to suggest that flow state is very attainable based on a certain set of things that you do or do not do, like skills, skills that can be learned and trained. And the first one of those things is that the first step in getting into a flow state is you have to balance challenge and skill. So challenge means it has to be hard enough that it's actually challenging to you. So challenge means it has to be hard enough that it's actually challenging to you, and you have to have a certain level of skill involved. So let's use an example of myself, for instance, when I was teaching high school English, I got good enough at it that there was no challenge and I had all skill. That's true.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:What happened? You got burnt out and you didn't put any care or thought into it. I was miserable. Yeah, because what happens when we have equal amounts of challenge and skill when we're pushing the envelope? So someone called this zone of proximal development. So there's a zone that is like right outside of your comfort zone where you always want to be pushing for and there are some biblical principles to this too, and we can talk about those as well but there's a zone right outside of your comfort zone that we should always be pushing for, cause does that create like stress in your system when you're like outside of that comfort zone?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Uh, it does if it's too far out, okay. So if I go too far out, think about Coco learning right now. If Coco goes too far outside of her comfort zone, what happens? Meltdown, meltdown. I can't do it, it's too hard, it's too scary, whatever.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:On the other hand, though, if we give her something that's like the perfect balance of what is challenging to her and what she's also skillful at, like using a sharp knife, she will sit and work on it for hours. Yes, got it, okay, using a sharp knife. She has to be focused. She doesn't necessarily have the skill, but she has enough of the skill because she's used her plastic knife. Yes, and it's also a challenge because she knows that if she doesn't, if she makes a mistake, she's going to get injured, right, right, right. And so some people would say we're bad parents, whatever. She's super independent, and we could talk about how kids get anxiety and why we let her do some of those things on another episode. But the the reason I bring that up is because, like that in it, that is the definition of flow state.
Heather Kimbley:So how do you know when you're in that, outside of that comfort zone, just outside?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Oh, when you're in the flow state, when you're in that perfect balance of challenge and skill.
Heather Kimbley:What does it?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:feel like yeah. So for me it feels like time goes away. Okay, it feels like I could work on something endlessly and just stop. So if you've ever heard me on those days when I'm like writing working at lunchtime and I go, oh my gosh, it's 2.45. I can't believe it's been two and a half hours already.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I feel like that's every day and I've just been working the whole entire time thinking about stuff. That's me in flow state, okay, when I'm adjusting people and I look up and I'm like, oh my gosh, it's 11 o'clock already and we have a trash can that's overflowing. That's flow state for me, yeah, and it's different for everybody. So it just depends on what they're skillful at, and you know there's a lot of. What's interesting is like there are ways to get into it, but this is also how you prevent burnout.
Heather Kimbley:Being in a flow state of something you enjoy.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, because the more you're in flow state, the more you're getting the perfect balance of challenge and skill. And this is what's cool is that we talk about the stress hormones, right? So we talk about cortisol, adrenaline, norepinephrine. In flow state we have dopamine, which can be bad in too high of amounts and everybody knows about like dopamine, addiction and withdrawal and whatever. But remember, dopamine is the anticipation of a reward, so wanting to do something well and achieve at it. So we have dopamine, we have adrenaline, we have norepinephrine, we have serotonin and there's another neurotransmitter which I won't talk about. So we have some of the stress hormones, but not all of them. And what's so interesting about the specifically with the flow state is that those neurotransmitters, the chemicals in the brain, actually inhibit some of the front part of the brain in a flow state.
Heather Kimbley:Why is?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:that, so yeah, so I want people to catch this.
Heather Kimbley:What does that mean?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, I want people to catch this because I think it's important, because I always talk about stress. Hormones turn off the front part of the brain. Right, that leads to decreased success. Yes, long term, in these flow states, though, we start to inhibit different parts of the frontal cortex, specifically like the lateral parts of it, and so those parts of the prefrontal cortex are responsible for our self-criticism, for our self-awareness, like for our judgment and the critical parts of our nature that would judge us and say I'm not good enough. So this gets super interesting, because now we're looking at not only do we have a mechanism of stress that can turn off the frontal cortex, but sometimes it's advantageous to us, in the right amounts, to have a cortex turned off so that we can get into a flow state. So we're not constantly thinking.
Heather Kimbley:Okay.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:So an example of this. If you recall, I would tell the story to you all the time when I was playing baseball in high school, I would warm up and the coaches are like Kimblee, you're starting Right, You're going to crush it. And I would get on the mound and I would warm up in the bullpen and I could throw, strike after strike after strike after strike, Wherever the catcher could put the ball or put his mitt. I could put the ball, no question. So confident Game starts Inning one. I'm on the mound First pitch Ball. And in my head, I'm on the mound First pitch ball. And in my head.
Heather Kimbley:I'm like shit, second pitch Negative self-talk already Ball.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Dude, am I going to mess this up? I don't know. Can I even do this? Am I about to walk this guy? Third pitch ball. Everybody's thinking I'm just a complete embarrassment. I'm a complete embarrassment, I'm not good enough, I suck. Fourth pitch walk. Oh my gosh, coach is going to pull me out. Next pit. Next batter comes up pitch ball. Walk the next person. And I would literally think myself into these cycles where, if I overthink, actually do worse than if I don't.
Heather Kimbley:So how did you out of a flow state? How did you knock yourself out of that flow state?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Well, it took me years because I didn't know any of this stuff.
Heather Kimbley:No, but like you were in the flow state minutes before, yeah, so how did you?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:overthinking, being overcritical and trying to overcorrect and try too hard. Okay, and you hear this all the time. I'm thinking of a silly example, but there's a movie called 10 cup and one of the things that happens in 10 cup. If you've seen the movie and you're a golf fan if you haven't seen it you should watch this fantastic movie.
Heather Kimbley:Nineties movie right Yep.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Uh, with Kevin Costner. And so there's a part where he's hitting every ball poorly and he's warming up with all these pros and he's hitting them down the line and the pros are like who is this guy? What happens in the movie is his coach says hey, what are you doing out there? Kevin Costner is confused and he says he doesn't know what to do and he lost a swing and all this stuff. His coach is like take your hat, turn it around backwards. He said take all the change in your left pocket and put it in your right pocket. And he said roll up one pant leg and then roll down your sock on the other leg. And he's like how is this going to help me hit the ball more? And he says go hit the ball.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And so he hits them and what ends up happening is he drives it straight down the range and all the pros are thinking like dang, okay, this guy knows what he's doing. And he asked his coach. He said, hey, what just happened? And the coach is like well, you stop thinking about your swing. And he could just flow and have fun because he was thinking about all the other stuff that he had him do. So silly example of flow state, but the idea is that if we overthink things, we will often mess them up.
Heather Kimbley:That's why, when I'm making cakes and I prepare so much in advance, it's like something that I want to do and it's not coming out exactly how I want. I start freaking out and messing up even more and more and more.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, and this is why. So what flow state is is not just this balance of skill and challenge. Because if you think about it, if you have all the skill but it's not challenging, you're going to be bored, not in flow state. But the opposite is true If you're all challenge and no skill, it's going to be difficult and you're just going to give up, right? So if I'm challenging myself so much and I don't feel like I have the skills, I'm going to give up. I'm going to mess myself up. I'm going to create that internally in my environment.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:It's going to show up in how I throw the ball or whatever the thing is. It could be adjusting people. It could be having a sales conversation with someone, it could be having a conversation with your spouse. There's a million places that this could show up all over life. But what's interesting is that flow state is also just effortless action. So where you watch someone and it's like they don't even have to try, and you see this all the time with people who are great at what they do. Yeah, watching Bodhi and Nadege sing, it's like how do you just call in Holy Spirit like that?
Heather Kimbley:Right, right.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Literally like first note.
Heather Kimbley:Well, that would be like for what you do for a living too.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, people go. Clients are like how did you know that I did squats today? Because I know your body so well, because I paid so much attention, and it becomes effortless for me to know your body because of the action and the skill and the challenge that I continue to like hold myself to. So am I always in the flow state? No, is anybody always in the flow state? No, but it's important to understand that this is God's design of there has to be the balance of skill and challenge. It has to be effortless action, which is what creates the flow state and we can think ourselves out of it, which also means we can work ourselves out of it, cause if we deplete all those neurotransmitters by just grinding harder, thinking that more harder work is going to get us a result, it doesn't make any sense.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:It's literally like the opposite of what should happen. Wow, cause we're just not going to be as productive. And again that goes back to the story, children's story, big principle, tortoise in the hair, patience, fruits of the spirit, that's good, yeah, um. And then I've talked about decreased time awareness. And then the other thing I think is interesting is how it affects, how flow state affects brain waves. So we increase theta and we increase alpha when we're in flow state.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:when we're in flow state, so alpha is going to be more like a sleepiness and theta is going to be more like an alertness, which is why it's kind of like that zone exactly, you're in the zone, and that's why time goes away, that's why it feels effortless, that's why it feels like I could do this forever and not even, and then look up and realize, oh my gosh, it's been four hours, yeah.
Heather Kimbley:It's flow state.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:It's just neurology within the brain, the neurotransmitters that we talked about.
Heather Kimbley:Is that why people can listen to like the frequency music and put them like the brain flow? The Spotify stations, you know what I'm talking about. They have those like frequency stations and is that like because of the thetas? Can that help you easily get in that flow state?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I think that.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:So it's a stimulus into the system, and I don't know enough about how the binaural beats work, but the thing, I think there's a piece of it that like, yes, they work Right, sure, and it could be the same way any music works.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:It's like it's the same reason that, like worship, is repetitive in a lot of ways because we're accessing a different state and that state allows us to get to a place. But key and flow is like, again, we have to have the balance of skill and challenge. So, like, if we're just laying and meditating, like that's not necessarily flow state per se, because flow state has to do with action, getting things done. So we're talking about productivity. We're talking about productivity of the brain. We're talking about grinding and hustling and the difference between effortless action I'm forcing it as hard as I can and white knuckling it the whole time. If you had a car and I said let's race down to San Diego and you drove 150 miles an hour and I drove in the slow lane with the cruise control on 55, who do you think would get there first?
Heather Kimbley:I would like to say there are lots of different factors, but if you're going off the tortoise and hare, you would make it there faster.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I can only believe that in my heart if you were going 150, because the amount of times that you're going to have to slow down, speed up, slow down, speed up, swerving and out swerving and out.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:You're going to run to slow down, speed up, slow down, speed up, swerving and out, swerving and out.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:You're going to run out of gas before the car. Just go and cruise control and like equate gas in the analogy with what's happening chemically in your brain and also the physical energy that your body has to be able to not just do the task effortlessly, be in the flow state, but enjoy life. Which is why, when I shared the story of me being burnt after working on that book that I was just trying to force so hard that I ended up pulling from the publisher because I realized that I was doing it for all the wrong reasons. I had no sense of purpose in it whatsoever. I kind of like lost myself in the whole thing and it was just a grind harder and work harder and do this stuff every single morning. But it took me a whole entire almost an entire vacation to recover, where then I wasn't even present and I didn't feel like I enjoyed it as much. Yeah, I bought the vacation, but I can't buy back the memory of going and me feeling like I just couldn't get my stuff together.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah, and if you're taking the whole time to decompress on a vacation just to allow for yourself to like, hopefully on the last day, enjoy your vacation or get into a familial flow state, just to go right back into it that Monday, like it doesn't really make sense doesn't make sense to me, to us, yeah, and that's like.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:That's why, you know, maybe this isn't for everybody, but for people who just don't want to grind their whole life away and they actually want to experience it and enjoy it along the way. And you know, I have some really close friends who have talked about the enjoyment and things that they wouldn't have normally done and just taking the extra time and how much more fruitful it's been to their life than a number in a bank account, which, again, not saying that money doesn't matter, but there's things that you money can't buy. It can't buy my relationship with Coco right now, later, you know.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:So then, what I want to get into now is just a little bit of a conversation of faith, because there's a piece of the flow state that is, like this, very technical. We got to have the right balance of skill and challenge zone, of proximal development. There's a very I don't want to say technical, necessarily, but there's the effortless action. And then the last piece of it is what, like what is faith's role in flow state and what I think is interesting about faith's role? So when you have faith, so connection to God as the father, um, the first thing is that faith actually increases our stress. Resilience?
Heather Kimbley:Wow.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah. So if you think about what when I say stress resilience, a way to think about it would be if I go to the gym and I put weight on the squat bar and I squat every day and I continue to make the weights heavier and heavier and heavier, my muscles are going to adapt to get stronger and stronger and stronger to lift the weight. Yeah, so faith can do the same thing with stress, resilience and our ability to deal with and handle and take on stress, strengthening the ability, strengthening our ability to take on more. Because if I believe that I'm not going to die and I'm still having fun in the process, because I can find a flow state in it, then life becomes more enjoyable. Yeah, and I have faith that it's all going to work out and I have faith that not all my clients are going to leave when I take a vacation for two weeks.
Heather Kimbley:Can you also say that when you're grinding and hustling hard, you're literally not having that faith in God or your business to produce the way you want it to?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, I think there's a balance. I think that if it becomes for me for so long in this business, it was about me and what I could do and what I created and the results that I got, and that was all about me. So then again it comes back to if it's all on me and I'm the only one responsible, where does that leave room for anyone else to help me?
Heather Kimbley:And I'm the only one responsible.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Where does that leave room for anyone else to help me? And God to me in 2022 said that's really cool. You built that Awesome. How do you feel? And I pretty much felt like crap and felt like I was just going to chase another number and I was going to move the goalpost and he said why don't you let me build it with you? So we tore down everything, made a whole bunch of changes that were not easy to do, struggled a lot for like a year, not financially, necessarily, but just mentally, spiritually, emotionally. Um had some challenging decisions to make, like relationships that probably could have been better than what they are. Whole bunch of stuff in there and the idea, like the thing within that, was to get us here where we have this level of trust.
Heather Kimbley:I think a cool thing about that story too is like you never had the grinding, hustling mentality to the extent that a lot of others have. You've always valued more of like that balance and flow state, but at that time you didn't have the faith that it was like outside of your control. So does that make sense?
Heather Kimbley:Like I don't know what I'm trying to say Maybe, yeah, I mean there, I never had the grind and hustle, but I also never had the faith, and so I was just kind of lazy. You had like the balance, but you were still missing that key component of the faith.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yep, for sure, and that's what the faith is, what helped me build the flow state Right, because I knew I was building what I had been called to build.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yes, and doing it in partnership with people who I care about, god being number one, but then doing it in partnership with you, doing it in partnership with the team who I can trust to take things off my plate, instead of me just wanting to do everything on my own and then being frustrated that I'm paying them to not do anything. So there's a level of like for real, as I had more faith, it gave me the trust to trust other people, which is huge, and this is like you know I. Some people probably hear this and they're like well, you don't have the biggest practice ever. It's like, that's cool, I don't need the biggest practice ever, cause what I just say. I want to have the balance and the flow state to be able to spend time with my family and not feel burnt out and make a huge impact and like, help people grow and have fun and do it all in the process.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah, I think it's cool the fact that, like you can say that, but like you, you also are experiencing like what we talk about, with profit to the highest level, in the sense that, like you, are able to profit from your life experiences with your family, cause that's what you value.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, and I couldn't always.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:That's like I think it's so important to just remember that I always I couldn't always do it, cause remember that I always I couldn't always do it because when I was teaching I didn't.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I had so much skill and no challenge and I was broken, addicted, broke, literally no money, um, poor mindsets, just completely broken when we had everything that we told we were supposed to have Right, and I felt that like at times over the course of even being in practice, where it's like, oh, we hit this number. But it's not about that stuff, it's about more than that and it's about creating a life of balance where you have clients who love you and clients that you love and it's about a family that you love. So when I get home at the end of the day, I'm more fired up and not burnt down by the people who have surrounding me in all areas of my life and I I truly think that you can only do that when you live from a flow state as much as you can and it's not possible to be in all the time, but truly being in that state where it's like I love what I do and I'm going to try to hit this zone as much as I possibly can.
Heather Kimbley:And you can put yourself in that state easily and pull yourself out of it easily.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Uh, I actually don't think it's that easy, but I think it just takes training and sometimes I'll get into it and I don't realize that I'm in it, like yesterday, really good example was West asked me a cool question, um, about creating value for people, and I turned it on and I got so passionate. Did you feel like this? Did you feel like I got fired up? Though? Oh yes, like I just flipped a switch where I was like I could talk about this for like four hours and then Danielle's coming back and she's saying hey, dude, there's people waiting.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:There's like people laying on the tables Come, get adjusted. So yeah it, um. It's. Sometimes it's hard to recognize when you're in it, but it is not a grind. There's a very different feeling between a flow state and a grind, very, very, very different feeling and I don't know how I'd explain it, but what I can say is that when you have faith, when you have the trust, you almost get more intuition. It's almost like a cheat code where you have more intuition to be able to take action. So again, circle this all back.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:What's the point is like this marathon approach right, we can run, run, run, run, run and then burn out. Or we can go slow, steady, wins the race marathon type approach. We know how the brain functions, but the intuitive action, it's all centered around action, where it's like I don't know why I did that thing with this person when I was adjusting them, but it was the right thing to do. And then their life has completely changed. I don't know why, at the right time, I felt like it was the right time to give up all my social media and hire Nadege, but it was the right thing to do and life has totally changed. So there's all these things that and I could say that with everybody on our team, I could say that with our relationship, I could say that with Coco. But it's just, there's a way that trusting and continuing to push that skill, challenge, balance has allowed me to be able to do more when I thought more couldn't possibly be done.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I like that, yeah. And then I can't help but just stress this one more time that I think the importance of understanding that flow state is action. It is not playing video games. That's a different kind of state. It is focused action on doing something and hopefully it's something that people love. Yeah, actually, I don't even know that they could be in a flow state if it wasn't something that they love. That was literally a question.
Heather Kimbley:I was going to ask, would you say the person's confidence in themselves affects their ability to enter flow state?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yes, a thousand percent. How do you rewire that thousand percent? So if someone doesn't believe in themselves, that is going to trigger a physiology within the body and the body is going to surround itself and seek out information to prove that that is true in their life. This makes sense what I'm saying.
Heather Kimbley:Can you give an example for that?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yes, if I think that all my relationships are always bad, my brain and I tell myself that every day my brain is going to wake up in the morning and it's going to go. Let's find all the evidence that that's true, that all the relationships in your life are bad. My wife said this to me. That was an attack on me. They looked at me this way at the grocery store. They must've thought my clothes were stupid, constantly seeking the validation of what we put into our brains.
Heather Kimbley:I feel like that's for relationship wise Like there have I've seen or heard of relationships being like that same. They're not confident in their relationship and so they're constantly seeking out subconsciously all these like negative thoughts and like attacks, and it just continues to spiral over and over and over again.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And it'll show up in your real life. So I can give a personal example, I can give a couple of them. So think about, like, when we first started practicing I had long hair, I had the man bun I thought in my head I needed to be like the surfer dude, the California, the California surfer dude. We're in the. We're in a beach community, we our offices like ocean view, we live right by the beach and I thought that I needed to be the cool surfer dude. So everything I did in the office, which was not me at all, had like the surfer dude vibe.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And then I wonder what that attracted into my life is like a bunch of people who were surfer dude type, people who weren't necessarily committed. And this isn't good, bad, right or wrong, but and I think there are obviously servers who are super committed but people who are just way casual, super chill, chill on the finances, didn't want to spend a lot of money, wouldn't show up because they would rather surf than show up, and it's like that to me. That frustrated me. But it was because I was trying to attract and be somebody who I wasn't. So then I felt insecure about being who I was pretending to be and then I wondered why a lot of people didn't want to come to the office to get adjusted or like why a lot of people didn't see me, or why a lot of people I would talk to and they'd be like, yeah, I'm interested, and then not fall through.
Heather Kimbley:Cause you weren't being true to who you were in your flow state.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And it was just a reflection of like. Because I was insecure about who I was, no one else could be secure in me.
Heather Kimbley:And you couldn't get to your flow state because you weren't confident in who you were.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Because I was trying too hard. Yeah, so again that same concept of me being the baseball pitcher. There's a ton of examples of this. It's like a really simple. This is such a simple example. Think about if you've ever tried to put thread through a needle, through the eye of a needle, it is so. It seems so insanely easy when you're like six inches apart, but as soon as you get the thread right to the edge it gets insanely harder. And then if you miss it a couple times and you're like I got to lick this thing and then it gets too wet and you can't do it, and then you're frustrated and you're like it's such a simple thing, because your intention is so high and you're trying so hard that your brain is literally blocking you Because you're not in an effortless action state. You're in an all effort, I'm trying, I'm going to force it, and we hear this all the time everywhere. We just don't apply it to like business and life.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah, I feel like you can reference that with athletics and like sports growing up so much.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:So to circle back, because Nadege asked a great question, so that's one. On one hand is like me, the man bun surfer dude want to be Dr Daniel who would wear like suits to present. The other version is now where it's like, whatever I'm in the mood for, I'm gonna listen to in the office. I will bump hardcore hip hop. That's Christian. I don't care and some people don't like it and I don't care. It's not that I don't care about them, but it's just me. It allows you, it allows me to get more in the flow state. Yeah, yeah and so. But then what happens is more people are just like dude. He's weird and he loves to talk about the brain and you got to go see him.
Heather Kimbley:But they're like attracted to that because you are in your authentic self, in their flow state.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, because you're getting into what I think part of the cheat code is. And all of this is that when you're in your flow state, you're in your who, you, who God designed you to be, state true identity and he and then, like the world, surrounds itself about around the identity and then you have more trust and confidence in yourself because really your identity is in the trust and what God can do through you. So if I don't believe it and I'm insecure, I'm going to look for all the places that are going to make me more insecure, but if I do believe it that's identity. He can do it through me. I've been called. If I've been called, then I'm worthy. And if I'm worthy, resistance is probably going to show up.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And what do we do with that? We try to get into a flow state so that we can make things happen almost effortlessly. We can take action. So good Cause, flow is action. But it's a it's requirement to understand the brain, because if we have too much self-criticism, self-doubt, we can't get into a flow state. And if we have too little wecriticism, self-doubt, we can't get into a flow state. And if we have too little, we're not going to get into a flow state because we're not going to take action. So we need this perfect balance. This is what's called homeostasis in the body. This is why we talk about vitalism in the office. Body is self-healing, self-regulating, self-maintaining. All that means is homeostasis. Whatever somebody's experiencing in their system is a result of what's happening with their neurology, and it's not good, bad, right or wrong. It's just the body either trying to protect itself or express itself at 100%.
Heather Kimbley:Wow, which directly ties to the importance of getting adjusted, because then you're reconfiguring your body and then you can function fully in the way your body was designed to be.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, fully in the way your body was designed to be. Yeah, when we adjust, we turn off the stress hormones and we influence the front part of the brain and this is through, like we go back to the brain waves, right? So theta and alpha if you look at where theta and alpha are at, what we're adjusting at is we're adjusting 12 to 14 impulses per second. So we're right, what you use, what we use, the way that we do it in the office, so we're right, what we use, the way that we do it in the office. So we're right. In between those two states, we're literally on the upper edge of all of them. Why? Because we create alertness, but we can also create relaxation, so that we're activating the frontal part of the brain. We're literally affecting brainwave. It's called the beta somatomotor rhythm and so every time we adjust somebody, literally what we are doing is bringing them closer to a flow state. So cool.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And the trick is that we have to get tools to maintain it. And if we'd never believe in ourselves and we don't change our mindsets, it's very difficult to do. Long-term we can still get amazing results, but we don't talk about change forever, understanding that, your mentality, your approach to life, the grind versus the not is ultimately what's going to determine, like, how much of the flow state you can be in in the first place. I give another example. So one of my friends, um, he probably wouldn't care if I share this story, I'll give two examples actually. So we talk about the marathon approach. So one of my friends used to be a marathon runner um has done lots of long distance stuff and he was just telling me a story this past weekend about he was running a race and I don't know how many he had done before that, so I don't know how knowledgeable he was about the process.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I'm not knowledgeable in the process of running a marathon, but a marathon you can't sprint five-minute miles for a marathon. Sure, physically not possible, maybe for someone it is. Yeah, there's always the exception, the average person probably not. So you could run fast, but you're probably going to have to bump up your time a little bit. I could run one mile for five minutes, but I can't run 26 of them. So we bump up the time, we make it a little bit slower, we go slower. So he gets to the last mile and he sees the bananas half bananas, like sitting on this table to grab just for some quick, easy energy before the last mile Gets all ego in his head and he decides not to take it and so he's like I'm just gonna leave it. And he said I hit just past the table. And he said what I guess runners call bunk, where their body doesn't drain, they have no more energy. So he had to walk the last mile so he didn't finish under what he could have finished.
Heather Kimbley:He finished like 12 minutes slower than what he wanted to actually finish which could be that mile like it mile, it would have made up the mile for sure, Because he didn't.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, because he didn't, he used his energy inefficiently, and so it's the same exact idea of what we're talking about. If we can get into flow state what I say effortless action. It took him effort, so much effort, just to walk, because he grinded too hard through the first 26 and then thought he was going to do it all on his own. I learned this lesson in business as well. Another one simple one, but so many people do. It is an example of something like 75 hard, and I've been guilty of this too 75 hard, freaking shredded. I look so good. Day 76, I'm eating pizza and drinking beer.
Heather Kimbley:Yeah.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Day 77, I'm like all right, I got to dial it back in, but like let me just get those donuts real quick.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And then I'll dial it back in on day 78. Day 78. Eat clean all day, babe. Let's just have burgers for dinner just tonight, it'll be fine. And then we'll start on Monday. So then you go, day 78, 79, 80, day 81. And you're back in the same routine that you were in before you started. 75 hard, right, because it's such a grind. Not that there's anything wrong with 75 hard, but it's like I just don't think that a lot of times people think about doing things that are going to be sustainable Like a balance within that nutritionally or exercise wise, all of that.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah. So it doesn't have to be balance within just the challenge and skill, but the balance overall of if we're grinding, grinding, grinding and I take these tiny little breaks you never catch up, you're burning yourself out.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yeah, I want to finish with a question because I think that I think that there's a lot that people could take away. I think the biggest thing is understanding neurology and how to get into a flow state right. So we have to balance challenge. We have to have skill, effort, that actionless effort or effortless action.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:I think the last piece of it is, if most people want to build something today and I am guilty of this almost every single day of my life but within the last six months, I've continually pushed myself to think differently and the thing that I would encourage people to leave with for this episode specifically, is that what if you were building it for 100 years instead of just for tomorrow or next year? Would you still grind every day, Whether it's a business, whether it's your family, whether it's whatever? Because I know for me, everything I'm trying to do now is because I want it to last Sustainable For a hundred years. So that means my relationship with Coco and the memory she has with me. I want those to last for a hundred years. So that means my relationship with Coco and the memory she has with me. I want those to last for a hundred years, so I'm not going to give up 10 years of them to build my business to a certain point and then go back and hope and pray that I can make up for the lost time.
Heather Kimbley:Right. Well, if you think about it too, like I'm not the most fashionable person, but like the, the companies that have stayed around the longest in the fashion industry, those luxury brands, they have goals that are set for like thousands of years and they're not turning out new every month Like the fast is. It's sustainable, it's long lasting because they know what their flow state is and their balance with what they're good at and just outside that comfort zone, with creating something just slightly different, maybe once a year or every few years. They're the ones that are lasting, whereas the fast fashion is just like grind, hustle, turn out as much as you can, whatever's new and different, and those are the businesses that are more so, either failing or just turning out differently.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Yep 100%, and I think it comes down to you don't have to grind. It doesn't have to be a grind Like. You're going to have to work hard, for sure, no matter what it is, you're going to have to work hard. You're going to have to put in work, you're going to have to train, you're going to have to communicate, you're going to have to do sales, you're going to have to do all the things Right.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:But A what is most important is just thinking about what does legacy actually mean? And if you knew that you had 100 years to do it, would you do it differently, versus trying to have it all done tomorrow and then being stressed and frustrated that it doesn't. And I think that's balance, and I think that's what God called us here to create. Like he didn't he literally. If you just look at the fruits of the spirit, he didn't. Let's just go through them. Because I think it's so important, I'm going to literally pull them up right now.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Okay, if I'm grinding, just the word in and of itself, grind. Think about gears, metal literally grinding together into little shards of metal. That does not sound pleasant. That's not joy, which is a gift of the spirit. If we talk about love, if I'm grinding, that doesn't sound like I, like most people, don't grind. And some people say that they love the grind and whatever. I'm not one of those people. Maybe I'm wrong. And if you're listening and you're one of those people who's like, nah, dude, I love the grind, it's like maybe this is not for you.
Heather Kimbley:Or write a comment as to why you feel that way. Yeah.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Like, share I would love to know the argument.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Right, um peace. There's no peace in grinding. Yeah, think about the, the. If we go back to the tortoise and the hare, the hare had to rush to the next thing Cause he was behind. I had to rush to the next thing because I'm behind, thinking about what's next, what's constantly. You can never be here right now. Right. Then we get into patients.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:If you're grinding because you're trying to get somewhere, again, that goes back to the a hundred year thing. It's like if, if you knew you had 100 years to build this and make it so it was lasting, what would you do? Different patient everybody wants it to happen overnight and I'm realizing the more it's like there's. I get so frustrated when the office isn't where I think it should be, but I realize that it's just a test of patience and it's like, hey, how like can you just continue and enjoy and love the moments along the way?
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Kindness, a lot of the people I know who are hustling and grinding are just straight up, not kind. They're not kind and it's transactional. So it's like, yeah, I use you for what I need you for and let's move on to the next thing. Goodness, there can be good in the hustle and grind. For sure. There could be good in the hustle and grind, for sure. But again, it's like I can express a lot more goodness when I'm not stressed out, because goodness is a frontal cortex. All of these skills are frontal cortex things.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Faithfulness If I put in my faith in myself because I just want to hustle and grind, it doesn't leave room for God, it doesn't leave room for the one who created every single thing in the entire universe. Right, how much more could you create if you co-created with him, versus trying to do it on your own and just grind? Yes, but it takes a level of faithfulness. That's why we step back. But life in all aspects has been so much more fruitful. We have a bigger team, we have a nicer house, we have like everything is better, everything is better. Self-control Sometimes the grind, it is like out of control. And if you moderate, yeah, you can't moderate, but that's a frontal cortex skill.
Heather Kimbley:And you lose that willpower for like self-control.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:Sometimes, yeah, If you, I mean, I did think about when we were grinding, like just first opening the business, I felt like and part of it was because I was so stressed out but I had no self-control in the food I ate, which is why I got soft. That's what I was thinking about, Because I just it was, every day I want to have a burger, Habit Burger and fries. So gross, so gross, Ridiculous, and I know there's people listening that eat that and that's not the judgment. But I'm just saying I had no self-control with that. I couldn't say no to drinking two beers every night after getting it done at the office, and now it's rare if you even find alcohol in our house. And then, lastly, gentleness, I think that the grind culture has this like you got to be super hard on yourself, Like we have to have the beat downs, but realistically, like God doesn't want to beat you down, he doesn't give you situations to beat you down. Or like crush you. It's not meant to be crushing, it's meant to be fulfilling. And I think that when you find a flow state for you, like we have that Jesus called us to bring heaven on earth, he didn't talk about just like do all these good things to get to heaven.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:That wasn't the thing I heard, I can't remember. I think it was Jamie Winship talking about. He said, like the baby dedications. He's like most people just do baby dedication because they're like God please, like, let my child get, bless my child, let's get them into heaven. But it's like no, that's not like that baby dedication, nothing wrong with it but it's like the opposite should be true. It's like let's teach them how to bring that here, Not wait until one day, and that's a gentle. Like. There's a gentle. There's a softer side of it and we talked about that in so much of our trainings with like, how we communicate recently is just like yeah, we could hard frame people and twist people's arms and do all this stuff, but there's a different way that activate fruits of the spirit.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:And when you can carry them with you. That allows for flow state, it allows for understanding that, like this game really is a marathon, and that's balance, that's profit, that's joy, that's how you live, in my opinion, a fulfilling life that, like, no one can take away from you. It's freedom.
Heather Kimbley:So good.
Dr. Daniel Kimbley:All right, fam, fam love you guys, peace.
